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"Freedom of expression is the matrix, the indispensable condition, of nearly every other form of freedom." — Benjamin N. Cardozo (discuss)

Adding Translate Extension[edit]

Hi everyone, I am trying to expand an OER called OpenSpeaks that I originally published in 2017 to help archivists and journalists to document indigenous and other languages. As the project is focused on multilingualism, it would be an irony to not have translations of the publication. But most importantly, there are several forms and templates that I am going to add eventually that can be used for content release, consent, etc. that need translations. But keeping my own project aside, I personally believe that having a smart content translation extension like Translate should be installed here for allowing Wikimedians to translate portions of publications where relevant. Not all languages have and can afford to have Wikiversity in their own language. My own language, which is spoken by about 40 million people, does not have and does not have a strong community to have a Wikiversity. But translating a form doesn't always require a whole project and a community to maintain it. So, I request the en Wikiversity here to share their views below to add the Translate extension. Thanks! --Psubhashish (discusscontribs) 13:51, 26 September 2019 (UTC)


Other comments[edit]

  • Do not support The translate extension is very complicated and requires new user groups, etc. A better solution would just be to have templates that create divs with different language codes (e.g. The following Spanish proverb is widely-known in Paraguay: "{{es|No hay rosa sin espina}}") and if really necessary, we can have individual pages with their information defined as a different language by an admin. (If you aren't familiar with this, see this has an option that admins have access to that allows them to redefine the language of a page; non-admins can only view it.) —Justin (koavf)TCM 16:12, 26 September 2019 (UTC)
    • There is a {{Translations}} approach already available that doesn't require divs. Subpages are added by language code. This seems easier to edit and support. -- Dave Braunschweig (discusscontribs) 16:37, 26 September 2019 (UTC)
      • @Koavf:, @Dave Braunschweig: Thanks for the comments. I'm still checking {{Translations}} but it (or the other alternative Koavf) still doesn't clarify my question - "if any changes are made to the original version, does it appear separately for the translator? Otherwise, how does one ensure that the amended changes are translated in the translated versions? --Psubhashish (discusscontribs) 16:48, 26 September 2019 (UTC)
        • @Psubhashish: Neither of these methods would automatically notify a possible translator that translations were out of sync. Do you anticipate dynamic content that is liable to change or static content (e.g. a transcription of a recording)? —Justin (koavf)TCM 17:19, 26 September 2019 (UTC)
          • @Koavf: Yes, it doesn't automatically notify but the Translation extension shows a notification saying that the translations are outdated when the source version is edited. So, if a translator is visiting the page, they will get to see the notification. When I first started, I wasn't being able to release new editions very frequently but I am opening it up now for more archivists to join in so I am expecting regular updates in the English version. Now, if the source version is edited by multiple authors, there is no way in the rest of the two suggested options to notify all the different language translators about what has been changed. It would be too cumbersome to document the amended changes or ask the authors to maintain such a log every time someone changes. Not all the translators will manually go through the diff to check what changed. --Psubhashish (discusscontribs) 05:04, 27 September 2019 (UTC)
  • This all seems a bit hypothetical at this point. We have unidentified participants editing unexpected changes using unknown groups and permissions managed by as yet unidentified administrator(s). My recommendation would be to use the tools that are available, including {{Translations}}, {{Translate}}, and talk pages to indicate what changes are made and when corresponding updates may be necessary. We can revisit the Translate extension after the participants have been identified and the scope of the problem that the extension will solve may be clearly documented. -- Dave Braunschweig (discusscontribs) 18:33, 27 September 2019 (UTC)
    • Thanks Justin and Dave for your comments. I will use {{Translations}}/{{Translate}} and see how it goes and we could have a follow up discussion based on the growth of the community and the demand of the needs that the Translate extension. --Psubhashish (discusscontribs) 06:27, 2 October 2019 (UTC)

The consultation on partial and temporary Foundation bans just started[edit]

-- Kbrown (WMF) 17:14, 30 September 2019 (UTC)

Wikiversity teaching expert needed[edit]

Can anyone suggest one or more editors who have been using Wikiversity to teach professionally at a post-secondary level, and would be willing to give me some advice from their experience? Any suggestions greatly appreciated! HLHJ (discusscontribs) 04:46, 1 October 2019 (UTC)

Anyone who can answer this, please add {{Ping|koavf}} in your response. Thanks. —Justin (koavf)TCM 06:26, 1 October 2019 (UTC)
@HLHJ: @Koavf: Happy to help if I can. Sincerely, James -- Jtneill - Talk - c 12:08, 1 October 2019 (UTC)
@HLHJ: @Koavf: Also User:Dave Braunschweig and User: Guy vandegrift. There are also others teaching using Wikiversity that you can learn from by example. See Collaborative Learning/Examples. -- Dave Braunschweig (discusscontribs) 13:01, 1 October 2019 (UTC)
@HLHJ: @Koavf: You might say that I am obsessed with using wikis to teach professionally at the post-secendary level. See Quizbank/Creating a bank so students won't ''break the bank''--Guy vandegrift (discusscontribs) 15:02, 1 October 2019 (UTC)

Thank you all very much, I wasn't expecting a response this quickly! Just the Userpage links you've provided have kept me busy looking through content for a while. I'm working on Ga naar Wikipedia, a howto for doing an academic's standard professional tasks on the Wikimedia wikis. As you can see, I've now used User:Dave Braunschweig and User:Jtneill/Teaching as examples of course content on Wikiversity. Guy vandegrift, I didn't see a central page I could link to for your course material, but two examples suffice, so no worries. May I suggest, by the way, that Cmglee has an interest in illustrating things like some of the physics-experiment diagrams you lack?

One specific query; is there a tool that turns a set of wiki-markup pages into a slideshow, analogous to the W3C's HTML Slidy? Something you could fullscreen and use at a talk?

I am a bit nervous about writing a how-to for something which I haven't actually done. I have no idea if my Ga naar Wikipedia#Education statements about using Wikiversity for education are sound or offbase, and I know that they are very vague and general. Advice, comments, criticism, and edits are very welcome. Thanks again to you all. HLHJ (discusscontribs) 03:52, 2 October 2019 (UTC)

It might also be worth taking a look at the HGAPS pages on psychology topics as another example of using wikiversity for the production of teaching materials. T.Shafee(Evo﹠Evo)talk 10:06, 2 October 2019 (UTC)
@HLHJ: I made a few minor edits, but overall the content is accurate for what you are presenting. I would recommend adding an introductory statement explaining the title. "Ga naar" seems to be "go to" in Dutch, but it isn't clear why the article (on English Wikiversity) wouldn't be titled Go to Wikipedia, or perhaps Learning with Wikimedia, since it addresses learning on most of the Wikimedia projects. -- Dave Braunschweig (discusscontribs) 13:24, 2 October 2019 (UTC)
Thank you for your help, Dave Braunschweig. I think you are right about the title; it's what pushed me to start writing it, but it's not informative. "Learning with Wikimedia" is a bit general for my scope... the scope is more "how to do ~all the professional tasks of an academic (or scholar) on Wikimedia". Snappy. I'll have a think about the title. I've added HGAPS, T.Shafee; thank you for the suggestion. HLHJ (discusscontribs) 02:05, 7 October 2019 (UTC)
@HLHJ: Think about whether a specific title helps people find the resource or hides it from a typical search. A scholar would be learning with Wikimedia? An academic would be teaching with Wikimedia? Teaching and learning with Wikimedia? Just some ideas. You'll figure out what works best for you and your audience eventually. -- Dave Braunschweig (discusscontribs) 13:39, 7 October 2019 (UTC)
@HLHJ: This is an excellent overall introduction to the possibilities of Wikimedia sister projects for scholarly work. I agree with Dave about revising the title. As far as I know, there is no HTML tidy equivalent way Frowny.svg of preparing slides within the Wikimedia projects. Sincerely, James -- Jtneill - Talk - c 20:12, 9 October 2019 (UTC)
Thank you, Jtneill, Dave Braunschweig! Smiley.svg. "Go unto Wikimedia, academics!" would keep some of the snap of the quote that inspired me, but might not be a great search term. I'm still not quite sure how I'd title it descriptively. "Using Wikimedia for your day-to-day academic work"?
I've proposed the creation of a wiki-based slideshow at the Community Wishlist Survey. It's at Wiki-based slideshows/posters. Comments and crit welcome, and I hope that anyone who likes the idea will go vote for it! HLHJ (discusscontribs) 23:58, 3 November 2019 (UTC)
The proposal for wiki-based slideshows has moved due to a merge. One vote so far... does anyone think this is a good idea? HLHJ (discusscontribs) 19:09, 23 November 2019 (UTC)
Is there a reason why RefToolbar is not available on Wikiversity? It seems as though it would be really useful. HLHJ (discusscontribs) 01:47, 4 November 2019 (UTC)

Developing transformative systems for thought[edit]

Long read that seems relevant to this community: (koavf)TCM 07:47, 4 October 2019 (UTC)


what can i do here? i want to write about Boston, etc. --GazaOaku (discusscontribs) 14:01, 5 October 2019 (UTC)

@GazaOaku: Welcome! See Wikiversity:What is Wikiversity?. Note also Wikiversity:What Wikiversity is not. Please note that Wikiversity is not a place for duplication of other Wikimedia projects. To write about Boston, consider using Wikipedia, Wikibooks, or Wikivoyage. To teach people about Boston and provide ways for them to learn about Boston through learning by doing, use Wikiversity. -- Dave Braunschweig (discusscontribs) 18:21, 5 October 2019 (UTC)
@GazaOaku: To piggyback on what Dave wrote, we have other projects that could have information about Boston as well, e.g. q:en:Boston for quotations (Wikisource for documents about the city, Wiktionary for definitions of terms, Commons has media like photos, Wikidata for structured data). I think that things you could do here related to Boston could be organizing real-life learning events like having a meet-up to do some urban archaeology or have multiple users go to a library or archive together to collaborate on research, etc. What did you want to learn about or teach others about in relation to Boston? —Justin (koavf)TCM 13:50, 6 October 2019 (UTC)

Usage of Template:CodeBox on Wikiversity[edit]

This template I originally designed for Wikipedia, and it was deemed unsuitable, as per [1], however, it was noted it may be of use on Wikiversity. How should I go about proposing it's usage, and finding interested parties? Example usage:

| 2 = function factorial(n)
	local x = 1
	for i = 2, n do
		x = x * i
	return x

| langname = Lua
| tryiturl =
| tryitname = TIO
function factorial(n)
	local x = 1
	for i = 2, n do
		x = x * i
	return x


--MoonyTheDwarf (discusscontribs) 16:58, 7 October 2019 (UTC)

Oh, this looks fun. As someone who doesn't really know much about programming, it seems like could be very useful for several programming modules here. —Justin (koavf)TCM 18:28, 7 October 2019 (UTC)
@MoonyTheDwarf: You just did propose it and attempt to find interested parties. Thanks! I suspect you'll have more luck actually editing existing resources to add example code than you will just getting people to jump on board. The template itself is fine, but it will take a good bit of time to set up the separate try-it links. I personally would want to know where I'm being redirected to, such as "Run this code on TIO" or "TIO: Run this code". -- Dave Braunschweig (discusscontribs) 21:28, 7 October 2019 (UTC)
Will do. First going to edit it so that site name is provided, then will look for places to try adding it to. Where do you recommend? --MoonyTheDwarf (discusscontribs) 21:31, 7 October 2019 (UTC)
@MoonyTheDwarf: You could check Wikiversity:Statistics for the most popular resources. -- Dave Braunschweig (discusscontribs) 23:43, 7 October 2019 (UTC)

At what point is a module too much?[edit]

I'm working on a course/set of courses for programming for the Gameboy hardware, and am wondering just how much I can automate via wikimedia Scribunto modules. Right now i'm planning to automate the creation of hex dumps for assembly listings (as manually creating hex dumps is error prone), and this involves building an entire assembler for the gameboy in lua in the form of a Scribunto module. At what point is the usage of lua for automating tasks too much?

--MoonyTheDwarf (discusscontribs) 20:23, 9 October 2019 (UTC)

@MoonyTheDwarf: It's your time, your passion. See Lua. It has a lot of capabilities, but it also has some idiosyncrasies. The real question to me is whether you would learn enough from doing it to be worth investing your time. There hasn't been much interest here in assembler programming, but we haven't had anyone attempt game programming that I know of. There's also the audience aspect. Assembler is a fairly limited skill set these days. I've done it, but I can probably count on one hand the people I know who can still do assembler if they had to. Is this project the best investment of your time personally? Is it what you want to do, even if no one else ever looks at it? If so, go for it, you'll be well-rewarded. If not, I'm sure there are other fun Lua things we can think of that wouldn't be quite so intense. -- Dave Braunschweig (discusscontribs) 22:52, 9 October 2019 (UTC)
@Dave Braunschweig: I have plenty of time, and want to do it never-the-less. However, i'm always open to ideas, if you have anything that might need done. Writing an assembler is a tedious process in a language that only has floats :p --MoonyTheDwarf (discusscontribs) 23:32, 9 October 2019 (UTC)
@Dave Braunschweig: Oh, also, it is possible to use MIT licensed code on wikipedia, right? If so, then I have a lot less work, as I know an existing assembler (For arbitrary systems, it's more general purpose) I could make use of. --MoonyTheDwarf (discusscontribs) 23:36, 9 October 2019 (UTC)
@MoonyTheDwarf: That hasn't come up before. In looking at the MIT license, I don't see anything that would restrict adding MIT-licensed content to Wikiversity. Wikiversity (Wikimedia) would then apply the CC-BY-SA license to it, but I don't see anything immediately that indicates that's a problem. You will have to include the MIT license at the top of the code. I would also include a reference to the original so that anyone who wants can get it under the MIT license rather than under CC-BY-SA (both licenses). -- Dave Braunschweig (discusscontribs) 01:35, 10 October 2019 (UTC)

CS1 citation templates[edit]

I noticed that some of the CS1 templates have been slowly diverging on Wikipedia versus here (e.g. |url-status= of {{cite journal}}). Is it likely that importing the newer version for Wikipedia will break things here or should it be safe to do so? (I thought I should maybe check before updating a template used in almost every page!) T.Shafee(Evo﹠Evo)talk 09:27, 13 October 2019 (UTC)

@Evolution and evolvability: In my experience, importing is a huge pain and results in an infinite amount of downstream headaches where template [x] is dependent on module [y] in an infinite regress. If you really think it's worth having the same syntax, I guess you can give it a shot but without having identical names for the fields, the templates function the exact same. Seems like a huge headache from my perspective but I wouldn't stand in someone's way if he really wants to go thru all the trouble. —Justin (koavf)TCM 09:57, 13 October 2019 (UTC)
We always get to a point where someone wants / needs a feature in the Wikipedia template that we don't have here. It's just a question of how often you want to deal with the updates. If it ain't broke, there's no need to fix it, but eventually there will be a need. -- Dave Braunschweig (discusscontribs) 14:30, 13 October 2019 (UTC)

Feedback wanted on Desktop Improvements project[edit]

07:15, 16 October 2019 (UTC)

Desktop Improvements Discussion[edit]

Is there any interest in suggesting that Wikiversity be a test wiki for this project? -- Dave Braunschweig (discusscontribs) 20:26, 18 October 2019 (UTC)

A link from fr.wikiversity ?[edit]

Hello, I tried to put a link from fr.wikiversity on my talk, I couldn't succeed (forbidden). Is it for I'm a new user ? Thanks ! --EclairEnZ (discusscontribs) 20:57, 18 October 2019 (UTC)

@EclairEnZ: Welcome! Yes, it's that you are a new user, and you tried to add an external link. You might try a [[fr:page]] internal link instead. I can never remember the format for a different language. It may be v:fr:page, or it may be fr:v:page. But something like that does work. If you can't figure it out, let me know and I'll find a working example. -- Dave Braunschweig (discusscontribs) 21:06, 18 October 2019 (UTC)
@Dave Braunschweig: Thank you. I have just been added to confirmed users, and I got it.
P-S : I'm astonished that I could translate the begining of a researh without doing too many mistakes. Internet translators can be useful... Face-wink.svg--EclairEnZ (discusscontribs) 21:18, 18 October 2019 (UTC)

Ask for help[edit]

Hello! I am looking for someone who would like to correct a short text, writing it in a correct English (mine is far for fluent ...). The text is on my user page, but I also put it on my talk, then il will be possible to do it. Thank you so much Smiley.svg --EclairEnZ (discusscontribs) 15:15, 20 October 2019 (UTC)
Y realized it could embarrassing for you. Nevermind, I think a friend of mind could do it... when we'll have time for that. --EclairEnZ (discusscontribs) 18:49, 20 October 2019 (UTC)

2020 Community Wishlist Survey[edit]

The 2020 Community Wishlist Survey is now open! This survey is the process where communities decide what the Community Tech team should work on over the next year. We encourage everyone to submit proposals until the deadline on November 11, or comment on other proposals to help make them better. To submit proposals, you can check out the guidelines on the survey page. This year, we’ll only be accepting wishes for non-Wikipedia content projects with no dedicated teams (i.e. Wikiversity, Wikibooks, Wiktionary, Wikiquote, Wikisource, Wikispecies, Wikivoyage, and Wikinews). To learn more about the new format, we invite you to visit the survey page. Thank you, and we look forward to seeing your proposals!

Sam Wilson ( TalkContribs ) … 00:57, 23 October 2019 (UTC)

Clarification of Curator Role, Membership, and Staff Listing[edit]

A discussion has been started at Wikiversity talk:Curators#Clarification of Role, Membership, and Staff Listing. Please participate in the discussion and add your perspective. -- Dave Braunschweig (discusscontribs) 02:20, 3 November 2019 (UTC)

Community Wishlist 2020[edit]

Magic Wand Icon 229981 Color Flipped.svg

IFried (WMF) 19:30, 4 November 2019 (UTC)


You can now vote for proposals at meta:Community Wishlist Survey 2020/Wikiversity. Please vote! HLHJ (discusscontribs) 19:07, 23 November 2019 (UTC)


thanks for the welcome also what can i write for the project? Thanks CezauroBlanca (discusscontribs) 15:20, 27 November 2019 (UTC)

can i write about Boston? or other locs? Or animals? Is this acceptable? CezauroBlanca (discusscontribs) 15:27, 27 November 2019 (UTC)

@CezauroBlanca: Welcome! See my response at User talk:Dave Braunschweig#Write?. If you just want to write, you can start writing about anything you like. Whatever you create is likely to be moved to Draft: space until you have time to expand on your ideas. Please note that Wikiversity is focused on learning by doing. Ultimately, the goal is not just to write, but to write something that helps others engage in the learning experience as well. -- Dave Braunschweig (discusscontribs) 15:33, 27 November 2019 (UTC)

Draft Space Cleanup[edit]

12-month moving average pageviews before and after introduction of draftspace (dotted line)

I have tagged all Draft: namespace resources that were unedited in the last 150 days with a 30-day proposed deletion. See Category:Proposed deletions to review. -- Dave Braunschweig (discusscontribs) 18:42, 1 December 2019 (UTC)

I use draftspace a lot and I agree with this policy. People with items up for deletion have a number of options:
  1. Improve the article in draft space or argue that it is complete and does not need improving.
  2. Move the draft into mainspace and see what happens
  3. Move the draft into your own userspace
  4. Save a permalink in your userspace. I like the latter because I can easily index them in case I ever want to complete the project. I keep a dated index of them at the bottom of my sandbox.I think it's OK to list them as external links by selecting "Permament link" under the "Tools" sidebar and saving the external link. The links look like this:
Nobody can be certain about this, but there is good reason to hope that removing the clutter from Wikiversity will make it a more popular resource.--Guy vandegrift (discusscontribs) 22:24, 1 December 2019 (UTC) -I added a new option and placed it first Guy vandegrift (discusscontribs) 13:37, 2 December 2019 (UTC)
Just FYI but the increase in popularity of Wikiversity coincides with the beginning and continuation of the WikiJournals. It also doesn't reflect that while the popularity of Wikiversity is increasing the number of new editors is decreasing. Wikiversity is the only WMF project with increasing popularity! --Marshallsumter (discusscontribs) 12:19, 2 December 2019 (UTC)
Also, as mentioned before, Google searches our Draft space. Resources that had high popularity before being put into Draft space had their popularity begin to recover once readers could find it in Draft space. Draft space does not improve resources, editors do! We need to address why we keep losing new editors! --Marshallsumter (discusscontribs) 12:29, 2 December 2019 (UTC)
I just did the math: according to Wikiversity:Statistics/2019/10 WikiJournals, and subpages, for 0.65% of the total request during that month. Rainwater harvesting is more than twice (1.77%) as popular. According to pageviews the rainwater top page is an order of magnitude more popular than any Journal landing page.[2] Correlation does not imply causation. The data supports that your observation is merely a coincidence. --mikeu talk 17:56, 3 December 2019 (UTC)
Note: MediaWiki:Robots.txt discourages search engine crawlers from retrieving urls in Draft space. If search engines are indexing drafts despite this we should look into other methods of blocking such as including a template with __NOINDEX__ in it. If a draft isn't ready to become a mainspace resource, it's not ready for indexing. --mikeu talk 16:34, 2 December 2019 (UTC)
I've created {{NOINDEX/DRAFT}} to address this. It adds __NOINDEX__ to pages only while they are in the Draft namespace. I will work on adding this to each Draft: page. I will also check What links here to verify that main pages aren't linking to draft resources. -- Dave Braunschweig (discusscontribs) 23:55, 2 December 2019 (UTC)
All main space links to draft resources have been removed, except for a few that are about or referencing Draft: pages rather than directing users to draft pages. -- Dave Braunschweig (discusscontribs) 03:05, 4 December 2019 (UTC)

This brings up a question: what is the default for indexing draft space? I wasn't sure, so I modified robots.txt but don't know if that is actually doing anything. IMO, NOINDEX should be the default for all pages in draft and user space. If that is not the case we may want to open a phab request. --mikeu talk 02:01, 3 December 2019 (UTC)

WoW you create this policy and then move hundreds of new resources created by me to Draft. That’s not a really friendly approach. @Marshallsumter that is a safe way to lose editors.

Tech201805 (discusscontribs) 06:38, 6 December 2019 (UTC)

Forming a User Group[edit]

It's only just sunk in that Wikiversity has no dedicated user group. There's the WikiJournal User group, but that has a rather specific remit. There's the Wikipedia & Education User Group, but that's broader and more focused on Wikipedia. There's the WikiToLearn User Group, but that's focused on the website.

Compare that to e.g. :

A thematic, multilingual User Group for Wikiversity would be valuable to represent and promote the interests of Wikiversity users as a whole at Strategy Summits and similar could be valuable (If there's a logical place to also post on then please repost/redirect from there). They are relatively simple to set up (Eligibility and Process). T.Shafee(Evo﹠Evo)talk 05:09, 3 December 2019 (UTC)

Can you give me an idea of how you think the above user groups have helped those respective sister projects? —Justin (koavf)TCM 07:40, 4 December 2019 (UTC)

2019/12 Comments about proposed deletion policy: 150 days unedited[edit]

Hi! Seems like there is a policy to propose to delete articles with no editions in 150 days. And articles like are now flagged for deletion. Mature, and good quality articles can fall into this policy. Seems to me a little bit aggressive policy. Tech201805 (discusscontribs) 06:57, 6 December 2019 (UTC)